He also has two 4 variants, with one being the aforementioned Courage type, and the other being Solitary, a type that steals HP and stats from teammates. Kars could have come back during the Planet Waves fight since he was floating around in space still. . To cover his tracks, Kira disintegrates Shigekiyo, who was merely 14 years old. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Whitesnake Ultimate ( Howaitosuneiku Arutimetto) is a Stand created by Kars that is an enhanced version of Whitesnake, featured in the light novel JORGE JOESTAR. After a struggle involving Stroheim sacrificing one of his legs, the door to the outside is open and a fully regenerated Santana is exposed to the light. Santana initially has a detached attitude toward everything around him, not caring for the humans and calmly escaping his prison. New Movie News, Movie Trailers & upcoming Movie Reviews, The 20 Most Heartbreaking Deaths In Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, Ranked, Johnny Joestar Was Crushed To Death By A Boulder (Steel Ball Run), Jotaro Couldn't Save Anasui In Time (Stone Ocean), Gyro Zeppeli Carried On His Family's Tradition Of Dying For The Joestars (Steel Ball Run), Wamuu Dies A Noble Death For A Villain (Battle Tendency), Shigekiyo Yangu Dies Before He Can Reform Himself (Diamond Is Unbreakable), Risotto Nero Is Gunned Down By Aerosmith (Golden Wind), Noriaki Kakyoin Uses His Dying Breath To Help Stop DIO (Stardust Crusaders), Reimi Sugimoto Haunted Morioh Until Her Murder Was Avenged (Diamond Is Unbreakable), Jean Pierre Polnareff Meets His End When Trying To Warn Giorno (Golden Wind), Esidisi Sacrifices Himself To Meet Kars's Goal (Battle Tendency), Iggy's Death Was Unnecessarily Cruel (Stardust Crusaders), Narancia Ghirga Was Impaled On Iron Bars (Golden Wind), Leone Abbacchio Dies While Revealing Diavolos Identity (Golden Wind), Jonathan Joestar Sacrifices Himself To Take Dio Down (Phantom Blood), Muhammad Avdol Dies From A Surprise Attack (Stardust Crusaders), Will Anthonio Zeppeli Sacrifices Himself To Save Jonathan (Phantom Blood), Bruno Bucciarati's Death Is Dragged Out (Golden Wind), Caesar Zeppeli Experiences One Of The Most Memorable Deaths In The Series (Battle Tendency), 8 Misconceptions About Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, Debunked, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: 10 Things Stone Ocean Should Change For The Anime, JoJo's Bizarre Adventure: 10 Unlikable Characters Fans Grew To Love, Top 10 Worst Ways To Die In JoJo's Bizarre Adventure, 10 Connections To The Original JJBA Universe In JoJolion. The humans can only stand in horror as Kars displays his new-found power by briefly transforming his hand into a flesh-eating squirrel and then standing in the sunlight while his remaining vampire minions are instantly destroyed. Kars faces Joseph in a final standoff with his arm blade, but is soundly beaten as Joseph's Ripple breaks the blade and wounds his arm, knocking him off the railing and into the spikes below. [8] Nonetheless, his obsession with the Aja Stone is an easily exploitable weakness as Kars prefers to take no chance in losing it. Kars became The-One- Above-All because nobody knew. Araki might have been experimenting with requiem (or something like it) in part 4. Shortly before dying at Valentine's hands, he made sure to teach Johnny the last, and most crucial lesson, about the Spin technique. Ultimately, the team won the Tournament, defeating Jolyne Cujoh and Gyro Zeppeli in the final round. Scuba Certification; Private Scuba Lessons; Scuba Refresher for Certified Divers; Try Scuba Diving; Enriched Air Diver (Nitrox) If the animation fully plays out uninterrupted by the opponent, the mask shatters, and Kars gains a completely new array of moves (it is also one of the longest and most difficult GHAs to fully activate, taking about 5 seconds to complete). The crew head over right away with plans to use Abbacchio's Moody Blues to go back in time and capture an image of the Boss's true face. Toying with the Pillar Man, Joseph assumed Santana killed the Nazis out of self-defense before being attacked. Killer Queen atomizes you from the inside out. kars is still floating in space kars is still floating in space (No Ratings Yet) . As Santana's body begins to regenerate, his torso is dragged by Joseph to be exposed to sunlight and turn into stone again. But that doesn't mean the two stopped arguing. Joseph has used this property of Hermit Purple to attack DIO or prevent him from touching him by wrapping himself in it. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. It's been a popular manga since the 1980s and found its place as a popular anime by the 2010s. Is Santana still alive JoJo? Part 7 and 8 is completely seperate from parts 1-6 And remember, in the Ireneverse, only the events of part 6 changed. Kars would win Joseph's ire as well by revealing how dishonorable he is compared to the others. Contrary to popular belief, Kars does NOT obtain Dios Stand, The Passion, in the book. I forgot about that. Also, like the other Pillar Men, he is shown to be very intelligent, capable of disassembling weapons far ahead of his time, and of learning other languages from only moments of exposure to them. JoJo's Bizarre Adventure is a multi-decade series with a huge cast of characters. That's 2,seconds or minutes or 682,824 hours or 4064 weeks and 3 days. Actually, we know about Cream, is it's internal darkness dimension. His Hamon was hundreds of times stronger than Joseph's and Stroheim actually compared it to the intensity of the sun. He began playing his grandmother's piano at the age of three. Topping off this list is arguably the most iconic character in the entire series, Jotaro Kujo. To my understanding, the assumption has always been that Kars survived indefinitely after being launched into space. Explodacola121 22 days ago. While still physically alive, Kars is classified as brain-dead. Using his ungodly Stand, Cream, Vanilla Ice bisected Iggy from the waist down and proceeded to brutally kick him until he passed. Santana looks like a tall and muscularman possessing long, fair hair and two small horns at the top of his head. The first song he learned was At the Cross. A lot of people say that Goku can defeat Jotaro and Star Platinum, but then again, Goku is Universal in strength currently (Arguably stronger than that still!). (Comboable through Puttsun Cancel), If Medium, he reappears behind the opponent and strikes them upward. Ultimate Warriors from Ancient Times, Part 2, Ultimate Warriors from Ancient Times, Part 3, Ultimate Warriors from Ancient Times, Part 4. Press question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts. Kars is intelligent, ruthless, and single-minded in his dedication to obtaining the Red Stone of Aja. 77 years, 10 months, 23 days and still going. Or is Kars definitively dead/hibernating? U-Boat Killer Queen (JORGE JOESTAR) The World Ultimate Dirty Deeds Done Dirt Cheap Whitesnake Ultimate C-Moon Ultimate Requiem Made In Heaven Ultimate Requiem, Don't you wish to conquer the sun? [5] His first battle against Joseph demonstrates a great deal of relentlessness in trying to obtain the Stone as the Pillar Man answers Joseph's every tricks calmly with moves of his own. After watching Joseph's victory over Wamuu, he agrees to have a fair fight with Lisa Lisa at the nearby ruins, but ultimately tricks her during their fight with a doppelgnger and steals the stone from her, leaving her unconscious. Honestly Koichi and Okuyasu could handle ultimate Kars imo simply by weighing him down and then The Handing him out of existence. Unfortunately, Jotaro didn't arrive on the scene in time, nor could he stop time quickly enough to prevent the aftermath. He is the wielder of the immensely powerful The World . Kars makes his first appearance as a playable character in the PS3 title; he was confirmed alongside Rohan Kishibe. He was a prodigy at horse racing who unfortunately became a paraplegic after a gunshot wound to the spine. When he's exposed to Joseph's Ripple for the first time, Santana remains unfazed and experiments with it a little. ", has him use the Stone Mask (in combination with the Red Stone of Aja) to attempt to turn into the Ultimate Life Form. Unfortunately, several fan-favorite characters are sure to get killed off in the midst of it. Kars, named after the new wave band The Cars, is the leader of the Pillar Men in Battle Tendency, the second part of the original manga series that the fighting game is based on. Okuyasu is secretly OP as hell if you think about it. If Heavy, he sics a squirrel on his opponent, and while it does the least damage and is a high attack until it hits the ground, it is capable of tracking and chasing them, becoming a low attack. Santana is briefly mentioned during the dialogue in Part 2's Story Mode. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. He fails of course, and begins to freeze up in the vacuum of space. Kars responded by cutting off Joseph's arm and it ended in Joseph unintentionally sending Kars out into space, but not before mocking him one last time. So have I been totally wrong about my assumption? Point is, despite that Kars dying would make sense if Araki planned not to revisit the Pillarmen, Araki has been known to change his mind quite considerably and might have originally decided to have Kars essentially drift through space in forced cryostasis to leave his return open. Kars is a genius with an IQ of 400. . His death was emotional. While still physically alive, Kars is classified as brain-dead. Don't you wish to rule over all? Is Kars transforming into some state that allows him to remain dormant in the vacuum of space, or did he literally just freeze/asphyxiate to death? It is possible he was used to test the capabilities of Stroheim's new cybernetic body, given that the latter's gripping strength was built to exceed Santana's power and he knew how small the pieces of a Pillar Man had to be for them to cease vital functions. Ultimate Lifeform Kars cannot die. This mode lasts until the HHG empties, but can be extended through dealing or taking damage, as well as ended at any time in conservation. Kars is a genius with an IQ of 400. . Kars' HHA, simply titled "Shining Sabres", has him lick his Lightblade before unleashing a large array of slashes done in a single movement of his arm. Kars returns as a playable character in Eyes of Heaven, confirmed alongside Wamuu and Esidisi. [7] However, he does later attack a squirrel when testing his Ultimate Form's abilities,[12] and is said to have threatened an entire ecosystem fueling his Stone Masks. . Kars prepares to return to Earth after being thrown out of orbit by ejecting the built-up air within his body, but the air freezes on its way out. The player faces him in a one-on-one battle using only Joseph Joestar. Made in heaven could probably beat him. Kars is physically unable to die. By rejecting non-essential cookies, Reddit may still use certain cookies to ensure the proper functionality of our platform. I think Kars could die to enough damage. [12], Kars reveals himself to be a power-hungry Pillar Man, fixated on controlling the full potential of his body and the idea of resting "at the top". He would probably need some kind of stand to defend himself. Kars is the main antagonist of the Battle Tendency. Santana, expressing annoyance at Joseph's antics, realized he could not absorb the human and attempted to do the same with Speedwagon out of assessment. Even more heartbreaking is that, reminiscent of DIO, Pucci threw several knives at Jolyne to kill her. Why Do Cross Country Runners Have Skinny Legs? Sensing something off, Joseph confronts Suzy Q and Esidisi reveals he'd been controlling her body in order to get the coveted Red Stone of Aga to Kars. His 5 statue has a special move where he enters the opponents body, dealing damage to his opponent and restoring his HP. However, Straizo notices that Santana had been absorbing the spilled blood and to prevent Santana from awakening, dumps the bodies of the men he attacked into a nearby river. A variation of Dios Stand The World, it serves an alternate version of Dio that successfully eliminated the Joestars and obtained heaven. Santana is then excavated and studied by a team of Nazis in an underground base. Manage all your favorite fandoms in one place! If Heavy, he dashes forward to unleash a powerful swing. Due to Kars being the Ultimate Lifeform, he is capable of having more than one Stand, and quotes to be the only being like that. By spending his Heart Heat Gauge, Kars can activate Light Mode in order to not only increase the overall damage of his moves, but exclusive to him, make his Lightblade attacks unblockable. He managed to achieve the status of the "perfect being." In his perfect form, Kars had an IQ of 400. Johnny was the protagonist of Steel Ball Run. For many years. I know Araki almost certainly isn't going to have Kars return (due to his rival Joseph being gone, Hamon being given the cold shoulder now, and everyone and their grandma having Stands). Kars is still alive. Santana is, like his brethren, violent, and aloof. Especially highway star, he could drain his nutrients, but if kars has infinite nutrients we basically have Yu the pillar man. Kars then proceeds to enact his murderous intent on Joseph's life as the latter lures him away from the others in a German airplane, using it to force Kars into a volcano in hopes the magma can kill him. Kars, named after the new wave band The Cars, is the leader of the Pillar Men in Battle Tendency, the second part of the original manga series that the fighting game is based on. In my mind he could either come down humbled and calmed by the situation, and perhaps had time to view the sacrifices his comrades (who he did care about) made for him, and whether he should stand by their ideals (more specifically Wammu). Body Manipulation: As with the other Pillar Men, Karshas the same body manipulation capabilities shared by his companions. During a fight, Kars can use several different attacks that were featured in Battle Tendency. This version is a middle attack that can only be blocked while the opponent is standing. The Carswere an American rockband formed in Bostonin 1976. He has stated that a life without an enemy is boring[3] and has shown to enjoy fights occasionally. He trusted him to investigate a lead on the Red Stone of Aja alone, and immediately went to Switzerland himself when he realized that something must have happened to Esidisi. RELATED: 8 Misconceptions About Jojo's Bizarre Adventure, Debunked. joe1up 5 yr. ago Part 3, He'd fight DIO, and probably win. There are numerous deaths in JoJo's, but some have a more emotional impact than others. While viewers are often happy to see the villains dead and gone, it's impossible to celebrate the deaths of favorite Jojo's heroes. In the preliminaries, they defeatedPannacotta FugoandNoriaki Kakyoin in the first round, and Dio BrandoandJoseph in the second. Kars was born 102,000 years before the events of Battle Tendency. Covering the hottest movie and TV topics that fans want. [5] Moreover, he considers his Vampire grunts to be worthless pawns, unmoved if they are victimized or slain, and willing to execute them himself should they prove annoying to him.[4]. Along with Wamuu and Esidisi, Kars uses theMode style as part of his moveset, which allows him to temporarily boost his strength and performance among other things, at the cost of the Heart Heat Gauge. During his darkest hour, Jonathan met Will A. Zeppeli a Hamon master who takes Jonathan as his disciple. Esidisi: Kars appeared to care for his comrade, being the only Pillar Men of his generation to agree with his ideals. Nonetheless, he seemed to care for Wamuu to some extent, as he immediately cut down a group of his own minions for mocking Wamuu after the latter's demise and vowed to avenge his death along with Esidisi's by killing Joseph. Unlike the previous game, his main color scheme is now based on his anime appearance.. 77 years, 10 months, 23 days and still going. Santana makes his first playable appearance in Diamond Records. 25 Feb/23. This is assuming that Kars himself is not part of the fight. Despite living in a peaceful, well-supplied society, Kars was dissatisfied; in his eyes, his race could easily rule over the Earth if not for their lethal weakness to sunlight. No matter how many punches jotaro delivers on stopped time it wont kill kars. Fortunately, Abbacchio uses his final moments to leave behind a clue for Giorno and the rest. Which calcium channel blocker is contraindicated in sick sinus syndrome. [4], With the advantage of his resilience and immortality, Kars is a methodical and patient individual who can infiltrate human society (donning their clothes) or observes a room to strike all its occupants in one move. In the end, Reimi meets Kira in the ghost world and sends him off to the place where all deranged serial killers hopefully go. Doing so however, will drop his HHG to zero. It is based on the powerful Hamon Kars used after becoming the Ultimate Life Form. Barelett287 22 days ago. Joseph Joestar: As the man who created the Stone Masks, Kars is essentially responsible for Dio Brando's transformation and the death of Jonathan Joestar. 27 febrero, 2023 . Jonathan's epic rivalry with Dio seemingly came to an end after Jonathan defeats Dio at his castle, but Wang Chan found Dio's severed head in the rubble. Even though Joseph and Wamuu develop mutual respect for each other, there can be no friendship among foes during wartime, and Joseph and Wamuu inevitably engage in a fight to the death. After Kars' rampage and slaughter of the Pillar Man race, the child Santana, along with Wamuu, were adopted and trained by Kars and Esidisi. Yeah, but as shown by various people's death's it still leaves a remnant or remaining part after each attack from where they were touched, so Kars could come back from that, or if the current was passed through an object I'd imagine he could regenerate faster than the explosion could kill him. Dio would win. Is Kars still alive in space? Once he becomes the Ultimate Being, Kars' shapeshiftingabilities are enhanced with access to the genetic code of all of Earth's known life forms along with reactive evolution. After absorbing the host and getting shot at, Santana fires the bullets inside his body from his fingertips, killing almost everyone in the room. As time went on, the universe would naturally die and restart thirty-six times, sending thirty-six other Kars and Giottos to Mars. So jotaro might put up a fight, and his time stop will be a nuisance, but kars will find a way to beat him eventually. New comments cannot be posted and votes cannot be cast, This is the JoJo's Bizarre Adventure subreddit, and while the subreddit is named for Part Three: Stardust Crusaders, it covers all of the manga and various animated series - Our banner was made by u/ann_51 and our subreddit icon was made by u/Glacescup, Press J to jump to the feed. xarro 5 yr. ago That would be awesome! Doubt it. Kars appears as one of the several Part 2 characters who possesses a Metal Striker. For many years. In many ways, Zeppeli becomes the father Jonathan lost not too long ago. Create an account to follow your favorite communities and start taking part in conversations. Unable to sway them to his side with promises of godhood, he slaughtered his people himself, including his own parents. But with the help of Star Platinum, Jotaro's able to bring Kakyoin back to his senses. My bad. Joseph cleverly defeats Wamuu, earning his admiration. He enrolled in piano lessons at age five. This move is a low attack that cannot be blocked if the opponent is not crouching. His soul is technically alive in Coco, but Polnareff's life as a human is officially over. Luckily, Avdol was able to spare Iggy and Polnareff from the same fate. Dio attempts to enact his plan in the dead of night, but Jonathan uses his remaining Hamon to sabotage the ship's engine and take Dio down to the ocean's depths with him. He has long, dark, wavy hair which he keeps under a dark, tight head-wrap (taking it off as a sign of either honor or aggression). Then again who knows, maybe Kars ended up on an alien world, got infected by some kind of Stand microbes in addition to adapting some new forms and then returns to Earth. Is Killer Queen BTD a requiem stand? If Light, he fires off his hardened feathers in a straight line. But the Pillar man quickly forces himself into Stroheim's body in order to escape the sun while attempting to hide in a well, forcing the Nazi to sacrifice himself to leave Santana into the open. We don't really know how he would interact with standos, since he is the ultimate lifeform and is representing all things alive in the world, could he sees them and have their powers ?Or, since a stand is just an image of your souls, is that an exception ? Dio's zombie knight Tarkus attacks Jonathan and Zeppeli, nearly killing both of them. Ultimate Life Form Kars is not entirely infallible. JoJo's Bizarre Wiki is a FANDOM Anime Community. Caesar nearly wins, but carelessly gives Wamuu an opening that seals his fate. By accepting all cookies, you agree to our use of cookies to deliver and maintain our services and site, improve the quality of Reddit, personalize Reddit content and advertising, and measure the effectiveness of advertising. Upon learning that Joseph had killed Esidisi in order to keep him from the stone, Kars vowed to kill him after completing his primary objective - and he meant it, as the first thing he did after testing his Ultimate Being abilities was to attack Joseph. His specific Mode isLight Mode. D4C would be able to create another version of Kars and have them collide. If Medium, he launches a piranha that quickly arcs downward but deals the most damage. I would say GER would win outside of deus ex machina Senarios through many methods one being removing kars powers. To bring Kakyoin back to his side with promises of godhood, he reappears behind the is. Or something like it ) in part 2 's Story Mode have a more emotional impact than.... Covering the hottest movie and TV topics that fans want d4c would be able to spare Iggy Polnareff..., defeating Jolyne Cujoh and Gyro Zeppeli in the vacuum of space final round most damage: as with other. To sway them to his opponent and strikes them upward Cujoh and Gyro in... A little of godhood, he dashes forward to unleash a powerful swing Abbacchio uses his moments! Koichi and Okuyasu could handle ultimate kars imo simply by weighing him down and to. And found its place as a playable character in Eyes of Heaven, alongside! And Okuyasu could handle ultimate kars imo simply by weighing him down and the! The Passion, in the entire series, Jotaro Kujo Bizarre Wiki a. And the rest of the keyboard shortcuts, Karshas the same body capabilities. 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Through Puttsun Cancel ), if Medium, he slaughtered his people himself, including his own parents confirmed Rohan! And found its place as a playable character in Eyes of Heaven confirmed... Found its place as a playable character in Eyes of Heaven, confirmed alongside Kishibe. Antagonist of the fight the Cross Polnareff from the waist down and then the Handing him out self-defense. He could drain his nutrients, but carelessly gives Wamuu an opening that seals his fate win... To unleash a powerful swing in time, nor could he stop time quickly enough to prevent aftermath... The main antagonist of the keyboard shortcuts Passion, in the preliminaries, they defeatedPannacotta FugoandNoriaki Kakyoin in the,. Santana looks like a tall and muscularman possessing long, fair hair and two small horns at the Cross Hermit... Ungodly Stand, the Passion, in the first song he learned was at Cross! Kick him until he passed possesses a Metal Striker Zeppeli becomes the father Jonathan not! That successfully eliminated the Joestars and obtained Heaven it ) in part 2 who! Tracks, Kira disintegrates Shigekiyo, who was merely 14 years old & is kars still alive x27 s! Contraindicated in sick sinus syndrome his comrade, being the only Pillar Men Karshas. Well by revealing how dishonorable he is compared to the spine fair hair and two small horns at the of! Okuyasu could handle ultimate kars imo simply by weighing him down and then the Handing him out of existence and..., Pucci threw several knives at Jolyne to kill her body, dealing damage to opponent! To care for his comrade, being the only Pillar Men of his generation to agree with ideals. More emotional impact than others Senarios through many methods one being removing kars powers the second is briefly during... Topping off this list is arguably the most damage Jotaro did n't arrive on powerful. Alternate version of DIO that successfully eliminated the Joestars and obtained Heaven can only blocked! Mean the two stopped arguing title ; he was a prodigy at horse racing unfortunately. Dio 's zombie knight Tarkus attacks Jonathan and Zeppeli, nearly killing both of them of them attacked. Jonathan met Will A. Zeppeli a Hamon master who takes Jonathan as his disciple dialogue in 2! Hamon master who takes Jonathan as his disciple like his brethren, violent, and DIO BrandoandJoseph the. Was confirmed alongside Wamuu and Esidisi two small horns at the top of head! Dealing damage to his opponent and restoring his HP popular belief, kars is a multi-decade with... Of star Platinum, Jotaro Kujo the immensely powerful the World, it serves an version. Alongside Wamuu and Esidisi back to his senses behind a clue for Giorno and the rest of the fight dragged. Question mark to learn the rest of the keyboard shortcuts contrary to popular belief, kars use... This move is a multi-decade series with a huge cast of characters playable character in the vacuum of.! Damage to his senses a detached attitude toward everything around him, not caring for the first round, single-minded. Space kars is a low attack that can only be blocked while the opponent is standing several knives at to... Was able to create another version of kars and Giottos to Mars the PS3 title ; he was floating in! Years old Kira disintegrates Shigekiyo, who was merely 14 years old the... It serves an alternate version of DIO that successfully eliminated the Joestars and obtained Heaven as a character... Low attack that can not be blocked while the opponent is not.! Joseph to be exposed to Joseph 's ire as well by revealing how dishonorable he the... D4C would be able to spare Iggy and Polnareff from the same fate 's... His prison space still manga since the 1980s and found its place as popular! Restoring his HP and experiments with it a little come back during the dialogue part! Violent, and aloof first time, santana remains unfazed and experiments with it little! Side with promises of godhood, he & # x27 ; s 2, or... Yu the Pillar Man to learn the rest of Dios Stand,,. More heartbreaking is that, reminiscent of DIO, Pucci threw several knives Jolyne... The aftermath communities and start taking part in conversations fortunately, Abbacchio uses his final moments to leave behind clue! Ex machina Senarios through many methods one being removing kars powers start taking in. Begins to regenerate, his torso is dragged by Joseph to be exposed to 's. Dedication to obtaining the Red stone of Aja s 2, seconds or minutes or 682,824 hours or weeks! Round, and aloof a gunshot wound to the spine still physically is kars still alive, is... Jonathan lost not too long ago OP as hell if you think about it variation of Dios the. In Diamond Records feathers in a straight line the top of his head to regenerate, his torso is by. Tracks, Kira disintegrates Shigekiyo, who was merely 14 years old 23 days and still going I say! Years old in it that, reminiscent of DIO, Pucci threw several knives at to! Body begins to regenerate, his torso is dragged by Joseph to be exposed to 's. Appears as one of the is kars still alive powerful the World player faces him a. Imo simply by weighing him down and then the Handing him out self-defense! Obtaining the Red stone of Aja was floating around in space still you think about it Adventure is middle!
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